[MHml] Chinese Trimaran

Fri May 20 21:07:12 EST 2005

Someone asked about the Changmai tri on this list.  There has been quite a 
thread on the f-boat list about it. I'm forwarding the story of the boat as 
told by the designer.

Bert

>To: F-Boats at yahoogroups.com
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>From: "aeromomentum" <aeromomentum at yahoo.com>
>
>Maybe I can give the group some information on the "Changmai 27".
>First off I am the designer and it is not a copy of any boat but a
>totally new design inspired by not only the Farrier designs made by
>Corsair (or the newer Corsairs not designed by Farrier) but also by
>the many other designs from many different designers and
>manufactures.  Not one line or dimension that I know of is the same
>as on a Farrier design but F27 or F28 sails will fit with slight
>modification.  Not even the basic proportions are the same as the
>F27.  You can stand up in the "Changmai 27".  The folding method is
>also a bit different and there are no "water" struts for support.
>
>The background on this project is kind of a long story but I will
>give a quick overview here.  Over three years ago I approached Mr. Lu
>senior to build my design in his factory on Changxing Island, Dalian,
>China.  I made an agreement with him, built the molds in the USA and
>shipped them to his factory in China.  I also shipped hardware and
>some other supplies for 3 boats (two for me in the USA and one to
>keep in China) to the factory.  My engineer and I went there in turn
>to help start production and one boat was built.  When we got to the
>factory Mr. Lu senior had retired and placed his son, Mr. Lu junior
>in charge.  My engineer and I were each there for one month since
>that was the limit of our visas at the time and the first boat was
>well on its way, but not finished, when we left.  This boat was then
>shipped to the USA and there were many problems.  We then went back
>to China but for a longer time to work on the second boat.  When we
>got there we saw that Mr. Lu had made 10 boats, all of them even
>worse than the first.  He had decided that the foam core that we
>specified was too expensive so he substituted low cost very low
>quality core.  Of course this made all of these 10 boats
>unacceptable.  We also found out that he copied the hardware we had
>sent him to use on the boats he was to build for us.  I expressed my
>dismay and I insisted that he use the supplied authentic hardware.
>He even was trying to make copies of the Andersen winches I had
>shipped to him.  He told us that the 10 boats would be for use only
>in China and that this is acceptable in China.  Since we had already
>shipped him the hardware we continued to make a second boat under our
>supervision.  This boat is much better than the first and was shipped
>to the USA last summer.  Still there have been problems with this
>boat including problems with the anodizing and acrylic windows and
>companionway boards.  Some of the hardware on this boat is also the
>copy hardware and not the hardware I had shipped him.
>
>But for me the biggest problem was that Mr. Lu junior then tired to
>sell the boats outside of China.  His agreement with me is that he is
>not to sell boats made to my design except to me or for use in China
>and then only with my inspection and approval.  The boats he is
>trying to sell are the 10 boats made with the wrong core material and
>are not approved.  He thinks that by just changing the name
>to "Changmai 27" makes it so that he can just sell boats built to my
>design.  The kayak on his web page is also of my design and he is
>also not to be offering this for sale.  I also understand that he
>just copied text from the Corsair web page to use on his own web
>page.  Due to this and other reasons I have now suspended my
>cooperation with Mr. Lu.  I hope in the future he decides to respect
>design ownership and copy rights.
>
>I am now working with another company on building a newer design of
>mine, the AeroMomentum 29.  This newer boat is very similar to
>the "Changmai 27" but longer, wider unfolded, bifolding arms for
>reduced folded height, all epoxy vacuum infusion construction, mostly
>USA materials, full carbon fiber spars and many other new features.
>The AM29 is to be sold in Europe for about 58K euros and in the USA
>for $59K.  The first boats should arrive in Europe in late summer and
>the USA in early fall.  I have worked with this different factory in
>China for a few years on other projects and have not had the same
>sort of issues as I have had with Mr. Lu.
>
>The first two 27 foot boats are for sale for $14K and $19K and are
>here in Stuart, FL.  Both of these boats are somewhat of a project
>but are a real steal.
>
>Mark Kettering
>772-463-6780
>mantafs at earthlink.net
>
>
>--- In F-Boats at yahoogroups.com, "vdepillis" <vdepillis at r...> wrote:
> > I suspect there is no easy way to shut down chinese piracy-- if
>there
> > was, Microsoft would have done it. I suspect that encouragement of
> > piracy is actually a sub-rosa state policy.
> >
> > Vincent.
> >
> >
> >
> > --- In F-Boats at yahoogroups.com, "Bill Gibbs" <billg at g...> wrote:
> > > Are they illegal?
> > > Or are they licensing Ian's designs?
> > > I don't want to jump to the wrong conclusion here.
> > >
> > > There may not be much you can do to a Chinese company in China,
>but
> > what
> > > happens when they export product in violation of intellectual
> > property
> > > laws?  It's not exactly counterfeit unless it says "Corsair" or
> > > "Farrier", but there ought to be some way to shut them down as
>it's
> > > still piracy.
> > >
> > > Bill
> > > Afterburner
> > >
> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > From: F-Boats at yahoogroups.com [mailto:F-Boats at yahoogroups.com] On
> > Behalf
> > > Of vdepillis
> > > Sent: Wednesday, May 18, 2005 4:28 PM
> > > To: F-Boats at yahoogroups.com
> > > Subject: Re: F-27....."made in China"???
> > >
> > > I recognize big chunks of the text-- is that from Ian's site or
> > from
> > > Corsair?  Sure makes me sick to see it.
> > >
> > >
> > > --- In F-Boats at yahoogroups.com, "C. Harvey" <harvey1 at l...> wrote:
> > > > Fellow F'ers,
> > > >
> > > > Looks like the Chinese are now copying the F-27......sort of.
> > > >
> > > > 
> <http://cmyacht.ebigchina.com/sdp/235381/4/cp-1035036.html>http://cmyacht.ebigchina.com/sdp/235381/4/cp-1035036.html
> > > >
> > > > -Christopher Harvey
> > > >  F-27 no.404 "Three Sigma"
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > >
> > > Yahoo! Groups Links
>
>
>
>
>
>
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